Charles Piper, b.circa 1790

Charles Piper and Ann Brown were parents of Mary Ann Piper who was born 5 Oct 1821 at Portland, Portumna and married my g-g-grandfather Stephen Grant . Charles Piper (a farmer) and Ann Brown were married in 1819 (family record). He worked for the Butler Stoney family who owned Portland House. Trenchs owned lands at Redwood, Lorrha containing some 338 acres, which could have been the reason that Grants from Shinrone were in Lorrha.

It is difficult, without more information to unravel the Pipers and/or tie them in definitively to the Palatine Pipers. My best guess, is that Charles Piper (born circa 1790 below) is the son of Charles Piper, born Rathkeale in 1769. and that James Piper and John Piper are his brothers. The dotted lines represent my best guess at the relationships.

The Palatine Pipers can be fully researched as far as about 1765, then the records stop in Rathkeale. So it is a question as to how, or indeed whether, Charles Piper born Rathkeale 1769 (in the first chart below), might be the father of "our" Charles Piper born circa 1790 (in the second chart below)

 

1811. A web tree gives a Piper family at Shannonvale, where a Charles Piper born 11 Feb 1811 (and son of another Charles Piper) marries a Margaret Armstrong (married Nov 1837), and has a son William Piper (b 24 Mar 1840 at Shannonvale, and dies in Canada in 1919). His wife Margaret (who came from Borrisokane) dies in 1843 at Nenagh, and the widower Charles Piper, remarries in 1844, emigrates to Canada, and raises another family in Canada.. (In fact a One World Tree gives him as having had a ealier first marriage, but gives no other details - certainly no children of it, if it existed, went to Canada with the family) His second wife is Elizabeth Ardell, b. 1823 from Borrisoleigh (or Nenagh depending on whose tree you read. Elizabeth's father as James Ardell and her mother as Jane Haskett. And the only James Ardell in Griffiths 1851 is at Cronavone, Glenkeen, a mile from Borrisoleigh. Given the marriage was in 1843, this could well be her father.). The dates are wrong for this to be "my" Charles Piper. The owner of the "big house" there is given Odell, John, Esq., Shannon-vale, Nenagh, co. Tipperary and Shannonvale is in Dromineer. Jane Haskett and husband James Ardell circa 1800 from County Tipperary, Ireland. Daughter was Elizabeth Ardell b. 1823 who married Charles Piper 1811 both from Tipperary. Charles and Elizabeth immigrated to Canada to Lucan, Biddulph Township Ontario approx. 1845. The family in Canada believe "My ancestor Charles Piper b. 1811, was in service to an Eng. landlord near Nenagh, Co. Tipp. Family legend (not the most reliable source for genealogists!) has it that brides were brought over from England for the household staff so that they did not inter-marry with the Irish. It is said that Charles chose an English bride named Margaret Armstrong, then had one son, William, b. 1841 in Co. Tipp. Margaret then died of measles. Charles then chose a bride from the local Irish population, one Elizabeth Ardel of Borrisoleigh, b. 1823. Thus, having taken an Irish bride, he could no longer stay in service of the estate (again old family stories) and was asked to leave and assisted with passage to Canada. Charles, Elizabeth and young William left for Upper Canada in 1845. I think that the word "English" to decribe Margaret Armstrong may well just be "Protestant". Similarly with a "mixed marriage" to Elizabeth Ardell, it was quite normal for the couple to emigrate to avoid the resultant problems at home in Ireland.

1828 Charles Piper. The Grant family burial plot in Mount Jerome Cemetery in Dublin includes the body of a Bombardier Charles Piper RHA no 3136, enlisted 1850. He dies 1883 and also his sister Mary Brooks died 1889 aged 59 (ie born 1830). Both are cited a "cousins" by my grandfather CW Grant . This implies they were children of a brother of Mary Ann Piper b1821 My father annotated to the Jerome entry that their father was James Piper of Portland, Lorrha, who married Margaret Grant. Charles Pipers death certificate shows he lived at 17 Greggs Lane, and died of Nephritis Pneumonia at Cork St Hospital. The record on Charles Piper shows from the records of the Royal Horse Artillery (source PRO Kew piece W097/1344). He is recorded as Charles Piper, by trade Labourer, born in parish of Uskane, near town of Borrisokane in Co. Tipperary. Gunner in Madras Artillery 4th Battalion Horse Brigade, joined 12 Jan. 1850. He served with them until 15th May 1861 when he volunteered for the British Army, Royal Artillery, with whom he served until 23 Feb. 1869. On retirement in 1868 his age was 40.5 years (therefore born 1828) His height was 5 ft 10.5 inches, fresh complexion, dark eyes, black hair, and intended to reside in Birkenhead, Cheshire on release. He received 4 good conduct badges and the Indian Mutiny Medal

1835 William Grant , the fourth son of John Grant (b.1770) and Elizabeth, was born in Shinrone on 10th Jan 1808. He married Mary Piper ( his brother Stephen Grant also married a Piper) in about 1835, probably in Lorrha (the church records for Lorrha are missing), and lived in Towra until about 1847 (the time of the famine again). He then moved to Lorrha, where he and his family lived with the Pipers. Griffiths Valuation show that William had a house in Lorrha in 1850. Of his children only the eldest, John, stayed in Ireland, where he was land steward at Cloghan Castle, Banagher. His daughter MaryAnn, who married Anthony Gallagher and went to live in Borris Co. Carlow, stayed in Ireland. All the rest emigrated to London, Ontario, Canada, where they settled in the late 19th century. A direct descendent (Mat Gallagher) confirmed in 1968 to my father that Mary Piper above, her sister (Ellen Piper, who married William Grant's first cousin James Grant of Shinrone) and Charles Piper who emigrated to London, Ontario in 1842, were all sibblings

1842 John Grant marries Margaret Piper at Shinrone (church records)

1850 Griffiths records the only Piper in whole of Tipperary is John Piper living at Sopwell, Uskane, Tipperary. Sopwell is a large townland (1113 acres) in Uskane civil parish, just 3 miles due east of Borrisokane town. It's about the same distance from Cloghjordan, which is to the SSE of Sopwell. There was a Sopwell Hall in the townland - Sopwell Hall was owned by the Trench family.

1857 James Piper, widower of Cloughjordan (father Charles Piper, farmer) marries Eliza Piercy, widow (father John Williams, farmer) on 15 Oct at Cloughjordan Church

1901 census Portland, Lorrha
Piper, John, 76 Head C of I, shepherd,widower,Portland Lorrha
Piper, John, 48 son C of I, shepherd, Portland Lorrha
Piper, Charlotte, 39 dau C of I, Portland Lorrha

1901 census Portland, Lorrha
Piper, John 58, single, Shepherd, C of I

 

2007 Antiques & Collectables Sale on Wednesday 21st March 2007 - An Aller Vale Loving Cup of Irish interest, decorated with a "Kerswell Daisy" pattern, and titled top rim, inscription "John Piper, Portland Tipperary", also with incised shepherds motto "O Shepherd true and tender.......", 15cm high. 50-60

I have also searched the North Tipperary Heritage records online and have found the following Pipers in Tipperary from 1800 to 1900

James Piper 1857 Modreeny, a labourer, m.Eliza Pierce, both of Cloughjordan marriage   C of I
Alfred Piper 1903 Birr, Offaly marriage   RC
           
Thomas Piper 1834 Templemore (father is William Piper, corporal 67th regt) birth   C of I
William Piper 1851 Templemore (father is William Piper) birth   C of I
James Piper 1853 Roscrea (father is William Piper) birth   C of I
Anne Piper 1858 Modreeny (father is James Piper) birth   C of I
Charles Piper 1859 Roscrea. Son of William & Eliza "Pipe" of Inane, father a ploughman birth   C of I
Bartholomew Piper 1884 Birr, Offaly birth    
George Piper 1886 Birr, Offaly birth    
           
William Piper 1853 Roscrea death   C of I
Elizabeth Piper 1880 Modreeny death age 21 C of I
Anne Piper 1892 Terryglass CR death age 74  
Eliza Piper 1892 Cloughjordan CR death age 84  
James Piper 1899 Borrisokane CR death age 81  
John Piper 1905 Modreeny C of I death age 84 C of I

Rathkeale and the Palatine Pipers/Pfeiffers

Canadian Pipers

One can conclude that Piper was not a very common name in Tipperary in the 19th century. There appear to be only two or three families of Piers, and they have by now all disappeared from the area.